Baby Names

It's sick to name your child that, sure, but to get your child removed from their household when there are children with 'normal' names who are not taken care of, raped and/or abused on a regular basis in other homes is even more sick to me.

From:

I agree with that.

Similar to the mother in Cincinnati who was letting her 13 year old starve to death. It is disgusting. I mean I know that NJ and Ohio have different CPS's but really? If CPS in Ohio couldn't check on a 13 year old with cerebral palsy because they couldn't be assed in 2009 then in 2011 the girl ends up dead - I imagine there are many other children being neglected and abused.

While I don't like when people name their kids disgusting things like that. Or even "Optimus Prime" naming your kid something sick/strange/weird =/= rape, starvation, and physical abuse.

From:

Well said!

This whole thing is just bizarre to me. I'm not understanding under what basis they had to take the child out of the home. At least in Seattle, Washington you cannot just remove a child unless there is more than suspicions. Yes, CPS will check up on someone if there is a report, but they will not come and remove the child unless something is actually found.

From:

vanish.livejournal.com

I remember the fiasco with the Adolf Hitler cake and wondered the same thing: Would anyone have even noticed the children were neglected if they weren't given White Nationalist themed names, and the media didn't zero in on them?

From:

vanish.livejournal.com

Not too long ago, it was discovered that a little girl was dead for, I think, two years before anybody even fucking noticed. Hello?? Now, I'm sure that the system is just overrun with an overwhelming amount of cases, but no child should slip through the cracks. And dead for two years? wth??

From:

I'm not clear on New Jersey law on this issue, but from where I'm standing if they've taken away the other three kids then the Campbells have obviously been deemed unfit parents and their forth child should be taken away. (I have a very difficult time believing that they could possibly be fit parents when they're naming their children shit like that. Forgive me, I do not pity the poor racists.) If the CPS wouldn't have caught onto their neglectful home situation if they'd been named Bob, Mary, Anne, and John, then I suppose that's the one blessing in disguise that their names offer. Unfortunately, I don't think foster parents have a right to change a child's name in New Jersey, but I hope the foster parents of those kids have as much as changed those kids' names, even if it just means calling them something else and having very serious discussions with the teacher at the start of every school year.

Also, naming your daughter Honszlynn and your son Hons would be a bad decision if it wasn't extremely bigoted. Watch the History Channel for five minutes and you'll be able to find some other Nazi names you like. :l

From:

Why is everyone assuming that the allegations of neglect and abuse are unfounded? Am I the only one in this post who actually wants to give the state of New Jersey the benefit of the doubt over Neo-Nazis?

From:

I guess so. If they were founded, it would have been stated at some point.

From:

I agree and I don't pity them either.

But I am concerned for children named Mary, Bob, Anne, and John who are being abused and CPS is getting reports of them and not doing anything. Like the previous case I mentioned. And there has been a few others where I am from where children were being hurt and CPS never bothered to stop by and look at the house/kids.

From:

I don't like neo-nazi's either.

My gripe is that articles I've pulled about this say "reported suspicion of abuse." Back home I reported an abuse case to CPS in Ohio - when I saw a child on multiple occasions being bullied/teased/and burned with cigarettes by his parents. CPS never even checked on the family, or saw the boy. Until a family member reported it a few years later. Since I was just a tutor at the school he went to apparently my tip didn't count. I'm generally just irritated that CPS may just be coming down on this family for giving their children ridicule magnet names. If their is no actual abuse happening and just the names then they should ask the parents to change the names.

Or maybe we should just make it so that if you want to name your child that then someone can refuse to put those things on a birth certificate.

From:

laminy.livejournal.com

Just because children with non-racist names are being abused, doesn't mean these children weren't in a bad situation too. It's not an either-or. These children were not taken away because of their names, they were taken away because abuse or neglect was suspected. Yes, their names are likely why CPS became suspicious, but that doesn't mean these children are any less deserving of being helped.

From:

mommyaubrey.livejournal.com

It says in the article that they weren't taken away because of their names.

From:

Alright, but the child was screened more than likely because of their name, which is what the OP is saying.

From:

No one said, "these children are any less deserving of being helped."

I'm not denying that there was no "reported suspicion" but a doctor who delivered the 4th child called. And no article listed his reasoning for it either. So it is likely he felt that the parents were neo-nazi's and therefore unfit to be parents. Without needing evidence to prove mistreatment.

I would also probably make these parents change their children's names or think them unfit parents. But if I were controlling CPS I would also check out every single case of "reported suspicion" as well.

From:

imamaryanne.livejournal.com

Remember, because these are minors, and the nature of CPS reports is so sensitive, the actual CPS findings may not be open to the public. So all the press has to go on is what the original calls were about.

From:

hermione-vader.livejournal.com

I think that's horrible to name your child that, but I live near the where that 20-year-old mother, Shelby Dasher, beat her 1-year-old son, Tyler, to death for crying. Which is worse?

From:

imamaryanne.livejournal.com

This isn't a zero-sum game. These kids being taken away by their parents in no way forces other kids to stay in abusive homes. It's not like CPS has a quota (or a cap) on kids to remove and removing kids for being raised by white supremacists means that other kids are going to be with truly neglectful/abusive parents.

From:

taleofaredhead.livejournal.com

"And no article listed his reasoning for it either. So it is likely he felt that the parents were neo-nazi's and therefore unfit to be parents. Without needing evidence to prove mistreatment. "

That's an enormous leap to make. It's quite likely that for confidentiality reasons, the allegations against the family couldn't be detailed in the news. Of course there's another angle to the story because of the names, and maybe the naming did tip them off, but in my mind that's a good thing. Like another poster commented below, it isn't as though there's a cap on the number of children they can take from their parents.

From:

imamaryanne.livejournal.com

Exactly. Many cps reports are confidential, and because of the public nature of this family, cps are probably keeping a tighter lid on it to protect the kids.

Also, the doctor likely treated the mom throughout her pregnancy. It's doubtful he saw her for a half hour of pushing and decided to call cps based on that. I remember during the cake story, I saw the parents and was pretty sure they were meth addicts. In addition to white supremacists.

Sad situation.

From:

If they were founded, it would have been stated at some point.

Not necessarily. I don't think the CPS is under any obligation to release that kind of information to the public.

From:

pixietangerine.livejournal.com

The article doesn't say why the doctor called Family Services about the newborn, so you can't really assume it has anything to do with the name. I used to know a couple who named their daughter Aryan (I think they might have spelled it Aryanne, but it was pronounced like Aryan and the father was an outspoken Neo-Nazi) and no one called CPS on them because of it. A lot of times extremism like white supremacy is a sign of severe mental instability caused by heavy drug abuse. Perhaps the mother was drug tested or the baby showed signs of withdrawal and tested positive for an illegal drug, it's not uncommon for a hospital to contact CPS in situations like that. The names are irrelevant except that they are the interesting part for the media, otherwise it'd just be "parents lose custody of some kids" and that happens all the time. I think it's kind of awful that the kids' names were released publicly, they had enough to deal with before the nation-wide humiliation.

From:

While it is really really horrible that not all cases are investigated as fully as they should be by the CPS, it's focusing your energy in entirely the wrong direction to complain about the times when the CPS does intervene.

Or maybe we should just make it so that if you want to name your child that then someone can refuse to put those things on a birth certificate.

There are countries where you are required to get a name approved before you can give it to your child. (Related to this post, Germany is one of them, and every single name that this couple has tried to give their kids would have been vetoed all the way to Jupiter.) I don't approve of all of the regulations in Germany, but I wouldn't mind a list of "banned names," including Adolf Hitler, Garbage, names like the ones mentioned in this post (http://baby-names.livejournal.com/5827102.html)*, and others along those lines.

*Spotlight surge! I had to go back more than 200 entries to find that!

From:

And no article listed his reasoning for it either.

The fact that their other three children had been taken away and not yet returned is reason enough.

But if I were controlling CPS I would also check out every single case of "reported suspicion" as well.

So complain when the CPS does nothing, not when they do something, because whether it's what you meant or not this post/your comments are coming off a lot like you begrudge these children the help they got. I'm sorry, I just really don't see how jumping on the CPS and questioning whether or not they acted too swiftly in a case you don't know even the vaguest of details about is supposed to encourage them to act more swiftly in the future.

I am not denying that there are problems in the system. Not at all. And "name-ism" isn't one of the worst ones, from what I've seen. (Institutional racism and classism are pretty high up there.) But a lot of the comments here seem to come dangerously close to "these children shouldn't have been taken away" when not taking children away is apparently the very thing you're trying to take the CPS to task for.

From:

I agree with you, but let the records show that the kids' names weren't released publicly when the CPS stepped in. Little Adolf Hitler has been in the spotlight ever since his parents sued Wal*Mart for refusing to put his full name on a birthday cake. It was definitely the Campbells' choice to have their children's names known to the entire nation.

From:

What kind of fucked up question is that?! Children should just be left in bad environments as long as other environments are worse? Really? "Sorry your dad calls you a worthless slut ten times a day, seven-year-old Sarah, but Jane's mother doesn't feed her!" "Sorry your mom doesn't feed you, Jane, but Matthew's dad hits him!" "Sorry your dad hits you, Matthew, but Ashley's dad hits harder!" "Sorry your dad hits you, Ashley, but Adam's custodial grandfather molests him!" ... at exactly what point does this kind of thinking stop? When the children turn up dead?

From:

hermione-vader.livejournal.com

Wait, what? That's not what I meant at all. Yikes. I was saying it's fucked up that kids get taken away because of their sick names, but kids with normal names end up dead because nothing like that tipped them off.

From:

Then why did you ask "Which is worse?" That seemed like a pretty clear way of undermining the assumed reason these children were taken away and to say that the boy who lived near you should have been taken away instead.

From:

ma-ee-uh.livejournal.com

Nope, that info is confidential.

From:

kitchen-poet.livejournal.com

My mom is a social worker who worked for CPS. In most cases, they seriously have their hands tied legally. Like, my mom would be called to remove a child from a home who was obviously being beaten, walk in and see six other abused children, and only be able to legally take the child with the reported injury. I'm guessing it wasn't a case of CPS "not bothering" to do their job, and it isn't cool that you just assumed that.

From:

piperwest12.livejournal.com

Ok I am from the NYC area and from what I remember of this case when it first happened, and remember this was a few years ago, CPS became involved because when the store refused to put the child's name on the cake there was a huge argument which required police involvement. When police showed up they found that one of the kids had some bruising to the face and started an investigation which led to the discovery of a filthy home and one of the parents having a past violent racist history, though I don't remember which one it was. The parents have not complied with the agency's requirements in terms of parenting classes and such, which is why the kids are still in foster care. Hope that clears up some of the questions people have.

From:

laminy.livejournal.com

No one said, "these children are any less deserving of being helped."

Really? Because to me, that's exactly what it sounds like, coming from more than one person in this post.

From:

joeandmiley.livejournal.com

i think there is definately more to this story than them naming there kids disgusting names i am guessing cps has or had some other more serious and legitimate reason for taking the kids and we just aren't being given all the facts

From:

Well, I apologize for the impression that everyone got. But some people got exactly what I was saying.

While I do with CPS would investigate most things. I'm not complaining that they did. MY QUESTION in my original post was: I wonder if CPS would have done anything if their names were "Bob...Mary..." that was it.

So stop getting all feisty.

From:

I'm not just assuming. And no one said they didn't bother to do their job in this case. But I also know people who work for CPS and they complain that coworkers and such do not bother in some cases.

It isn't cool to put words in people's mouths.

From:

I said it was 'likely,' and that isn't a huge leap.

A huge leap to make would be that the doctor called for no reason.

I'm not trying to defend them at all. I am Jewish and lost relatives in the holocaust, defending nazis is the last thing I want to do with my time.

From:

*I do wish

From:

I don't think in any of my comments I am saying that they judged too swiftly etc.

My question was I wonder if CPS would have done anything if their names were "Bob...Mary..."(?) I wanted your opinions. My comments gave examples of children with normal names where nothing was done.

I wanted people's thoughts on the situation.

From:

From the follow up articles I read I believe it was the father who had the violent history.

From:

I'm sure there is. My post title was for attention grabbing purposes. Also it is pretty close to a title on a few other online articles about this situation. So I figured it would fit.

My post title isn't my opinion. Just to state that since so many people assume that it is. :P

From:

My post title was for attention grabbing purposes.

I was just asking a baby-naming community if they felt that the names were part of the reason the family was quickly screened and what would happen if they had different names.

I agree that it is sad that they released the names. Hopefully these kids will have a different mindset then their parents and get a chance to change the names and start over.

From:

I'm not complaining about them intervening. My original post was asking for your opinions on the situation. I only posted comments of times when CPS did nothing with cases involving normal names.

In fact, I say many times that I am not saying that they had no reason to take these kids away. I'm glad they did. I would also take kids away from neo-nazis. So in no way am I complaining. At all.

I agree with you on the naming thing though.
I believe in Mexico they also have a law that you can't name your kid words. Like "Azul," and "Llueve"

From:

kitchen-poet.livejournal.com

"It isn't cool to put words in people's mouths."

"But then I wonder if CPS would have caught on to suspicions of abuse if the kids were named Mary, Bob, and Billy...etc. I hear this and just a week ago I read about a mom in Ohio who let her 13 year old disabled daughter starve to death. And CPS was called 2 years before but didn't bother to check on the child."

I didn't.

From: